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Accounts 17-18 11:08 - Apr 27 with 7635 viewsjasper_T

Up on Companies House now.

https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/00123414/filing-history
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Accounts 17-18 on 11:47 - Apr 27 with 3373 viewsleighton1318

That’s one fugly set of accounts, though probably not a huge surprise.

Statement re ‘material uncertainty regarding going concern’ is just a statement of the obvious I suppose.

Highlights that the cash flow forecasts to support the going concern assumption are dependent on player transfers, again a statement of what we knew.

Scale of the debtors and creditors (relating to player transfers) is what I find staggering: we are (were, as of last July) owed £29m, but are owing £41m. (Notes 13 & 14).

Bank debt about £15m

Contingent liabilities of £20m (note 22) dependent on players staying on/ performance - these are in addition to balance sheet liabilities.

No cash flow statement

Happy to be corrected in any of the above. The interesting document would be the cash flow forecasts going forward to show how the business trades out of that debt, and which no doubt the Board would see.

Dan James better start packing his bags ...
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Accounts 17-18 on 12:24 - Apr 27 with 3314 viewsIAN05

Accounts 17-18 on 11:47 - Apr 27 by leighton1318

That’s one fugly set of accounts, though probably not a huge surprise.

Statement re ‘material uncertainty regarding going concern’ is just a statement of the obvious I suppose.

Highlights that the cash flow forecasts to support the going concern assumption are dependent on player transfers, again a statement of what we knew.

Scale of the debtors and creditors (relating to player transfers) is what I find staggering: we are (were, as of last July) owed £29m, but are owing £41m. (Notes 13 & 14).

Bank debt about £15m

Contingent liabilities of £20m (note 22) dependent on players staying on/ performance - these are in addition to balance sheet liabilities.

No cash flow statement

Happy to be corrected in any of the above. The interesting document would be the cash flow forecasts going forward to show how the business trades out of that debt, and which no doubt the Board would see.

Dan James better start packing his bags ...


The cash flows are key to see and why the Trust need to keep fighting to see more detail. Bank debt etc is difficult to gauge as we fastrack payments on sales etc so the true picture becomes clouded in annual accounts that are only seen 9 months later.
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Accounts 17-18 on 17:14 - Apr 27 with 3100 viewsvalleyboy

Accounts 17-18 on 11:47 - Apr 27 by leighton1318

That’s one fugly set of accounts, though probably not a huge surprise.

Statement re ‘material uncertainty regarding going concern’ is just a statement of the obvious I suppose.

Highlights that the cash flow forecasts to support the going concern assumption are dependent on player transfers, again a statement of what we knew.

Scale of the debtors and creditors (relating to player transfers) is what I find staggering: we are (were, as of last July) owed £29m, but are owing £41m. (Notes 13 & 14).

Bank debt about £15m

Contingent liabilities of £20m (note 22) dependent on players staying on/ performance - these are in addition to balance sheet liabilities.

No cash flow statement

Happy to be corrected in any of the above. The interesting document would be the cash flow forecasts going forward to show how the business trades out of that debt, and which no doubt the Board would see.

Dan James better start packing his bags ...


“Highlights that the cash flow forecasts to support the going concern assumption are dependent on player transfer

I would say that’s more than an assumption

Not only supporters know that there’s a cash flow problem, but clubs that want to buy any Swansea players know it as well

I would say another “fire sale” on the horizon

For instance

What club will pay A Ayew £80k per week as what he was paid in Swansea

Not only will he go for a knock down price, but will be looking for a pay off as well

What I see happening. Is that Swansea will try to get a season long loan for him but still be paying part of his wages
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Accounts 17-18 on 18:33 - Apr 27 with 3008 viewswaynekerr55

Accounts 17-18 on 11:47 - Apr 27 by leighton1318

That’s one fugly set of accounts, though probably not a huge surprise.

Statement re ‘material uncertainty regarding going concern’ is just a statement of the obvious I suppose.

Highlights that the cash flow forecasts to support the going concern assumption are dependent on player transfers, again a statement of what we knew.

Scale of the debtors and creditors (relating to player transfers) is what I find staggering: we are (were, as of last July) owed £29m, but are owing £41m. (Notes 13 & 14).

Bank debt about £15m

Contingent liabilities of £20m (note 22) dependent on players staying on/ performance - these are in addition to balance sheet liabilities.

No cash flow statement

Happy to be corrected in any of the above. The interesting document would be the cash flow forecasts going forward to show how the business trades out of that debt, and which no doubt the Board would see.

Dan James better start packing his bags ...


And yet there were those who thought Jenkins was the right man, despite this being his handy work.

The Americans haven't helped themselves (primarily by keeping him as one), but if I was them I'd be asking serious questions around the company they employed to conduct due dilligence before the sale

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Accounts 17-18 on 18:44 - Apr 27 with 2979 viewsWingstandwood

Accounts 17-18 on 18:33 - Apr 27 by waynekerr55

And yet there were those who thought Jenkins was the right man, despite this being his handy work.

The Americans haven't helped themselves (primarily by keeping him as one), but if I was them I'd be asking serious questions around the company they employed to conduct due dilligence before the sale


Aye, remember all that"'better the devil you know", the club cannot do without him sh1te!

All the b@llocks from his apologists who seriously thought it was sound practice to let a ruinous rank amatuer Kamikaze case run riot and waste tens of millions of Pounds over and over again.

Could have paid someone the same wages as Jenkins and saved tens of millions of pounds in the process.
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Accounts 17-18 on 19:43 - Apr 27 with 2848 viewsvalleyboy

Accounts 17-18 on 18:44 - Apr 27 by Wingstandwood

Aye, remember all that"'better the devil you know", the club cannot do without him sh1te!

All the b@llocks from his apologists who seriously thought it was sound practice to let a ruinous rank amatuer Kamikaze case run riot and waste tens of millions of Pounds over and over again.

Could have paid someone the same wages as Jenkins and saved tens of millions of pounds in the process.


Must be another poster suffering from dementia

You have obviously forgotten the times that Jenkins was the best thing since sliced bread

It’s no good shouting about him now

You should have seen through him years ago
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Accounts 17-18 on 19:45 - Apr 27 with 2849 viewsmajorraglan

I may be wrong here, but if the end of Financial Year Is the 31st of July doesn't that mean that the proceeds of the “fire-sale” in August aren’t included? It may be that the proceeds of Mawson, Clucas, Amat, Fernandez transfers and then the potential loan fee for Jordan Ayew aren’t factored in to these figures. They would still not make great reading, but it may not be quite as alarming and bad as it appears on first glance. It begs the question as to what’s been going on. If I were the American owners and the Trust I wouldn’t be very happy.
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Accounts 17-18 on 19:59 - Apr 27 with 2824 viewsjasper_T

Accounts 17-18 on 19:45 - Apr 27 by majorraglan

I may be wrong here, but if the end of Financial Year Is the 31st of July doesn't that mean that the proceeds of the “fire-sale” in August aren’t included? It may be that the proceeds of Mawson, Clucas, Amat, Fernandez transfers and then the potential loan fee for Jordan Ayew aren’t factored in to these figures. They would still not make great reading, but it may not be quite as alarming and bad as it appears on first glance. It begs the question as to what’s been going on. If I were the American owners and the Trust I wouldn’t be very happy.


No, they're not included. This is last year's accounts.
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Accounts 17-18 on 20:46 - Apr 27 with 2733 viewsvalleyboy

Accounts 17-18 on 19:45 - Apr 27 by majorraglan

I may be wrong here, but if the end of Financial Year Is the 31st of July doesn't that mean that the proceeds of the “fire-sale” in August aren’t included? It may be that the proceeds of Mawson, Clucas, Amat, Fernandez transfers and then the potential loan fee for Jordan Ayew aren’t factored in to these figures. They would still not make great reading, but it may not be quite as alarming and bad as it appears on first glance. It begs the question as to what’s been going on. If I were the American owners and the Trust I wouldn’t be very happy.


Im not that sure if the sale of those players are going to alter the financial position much

Until you know the details of the transfer and whether Swansea are paying part of the mentioned players wages. Or how much was given to the player to move to their new clubs

It’s not easy to know how good or bad those transfers were
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Accounts 17-18 on 20:57 - Apr 27 with 2706 viewsWingstandwood

Accounts 17-18 on 19:43 - Apr 27 by valleyboy

Must be another poster suffering from dementia

You have obviously forgotten the times that Jenkins was the best thing since sliced bread

It’s no good shouting about him now

You should have seen through him years ago


I suspect from reading your post you saw right through Jenkins in times well before his head ended right up his own arse, before his self appointed D.o.F role, and well before he had not acquired a God complex.

Out of interest what got the alarm bells to ring so loudly with yourself whilst many others (myself included) were utterly oblivious of his real character, his lack of morals and lack of genuine professional competence?
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Accounts 17-18 on 20:59 - Apr 27 with 2698 viewsmajorraglan

Accounts 17-18 on 20:46 - Apr 27 by valleyboy

Im not that sure if the sale of those players are going to alter the financial position much

Until you know the details of the transfer and whether Swansea are paying part of the mentioned players wages. Or how much was given to the player to move to their new clubs

It’s not easy to know how good or bad those transfers were


We imagine that the Mawson transfer reportedly £14m, Fernandez £6m and Clucas £6m will have seen a tidy chunk of wedge come in. May not see the whole amount go in to the club coffers, but we are talking about £26m there.
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Accounts 17-18 on 21:02 - Apr 27 with 2688 viewsjasper_T

Accounts 17-18 on 20:59 - Apr 27 by majorraglan

We imagine that the Mawson transfer reportedly £14m, Fernandez £6m and Clucas £6m will have seen a tidy chunk of wedge come in. May not see the whole amount go in to the club coffers, but we are talking about £26m there.


And the budget deficit started at £60m so we needed a few more fees before there were any coffers to speak of.

Cash down to only half a million at the start of the summer.
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Accounts 17-18 on 21:27 - Apr 27 with 2630 viewsNotLoyal

Accounts 17-18 on 20:46 - Apr 27 by valleyboy

Im not that sure if the sale of those players are going to alter the financial position much

Until you know the details of the transfer and whether Swansea are paying part of the mentioned players wages. Or how much was given to the player to move to their new clubs

It’s not easy to know how good or bad those transfers were


Your posting style is developing nicely and is becoming very ...
Obvious.

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Accounts 17-18 on 22:17 - Apr 27 with 2569 viewsmajorraglan

Accounts 17-18 on 21:02 - Apr 27 by jasper_T

And the budget deficit started at £60m so we needed a few more fees before there were any coffers to speak of.

Cash down to only half a million at the start of the summer.


I totally agree with you there’s a black hole in the finances. The transfers outlined plus those of Bartley and Fabianski will hopefully have made some inroads as will the reduction in the wage bill moving these players on and loaning out of the Ayew’s, Baston , Bony, Carroll, Montero (albeit potentially with a requirement to subsidise some of the age bill) etc.

Clearly there are still some significant issues to address which is why I suspect Trevor Birch has been brought in, hopefully he can see there is some real potential in this squad and will be able to find a way of supporting Potter as well as ensuring we get the best possible price for those assets we decide to move on. After what’s taking place over the last few years, I hope the club can consolidate and start to move forward.
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Accounts 17-18 on 22:23 - Apr 27 with 2558 viewsDr_Winston

Accounts 17-18 on 22:17 - Apr 27 by majorraglan

I totally agree with you there’s a black hole in the finances. The transfers outlined plus those of Bartley and Fabianski will hopefully have made some inroads as will the reduction in the wage bill moving these players on and loaning out of the Ayew’s, Baston , Bony, Carroll, Montero (albeit potentially with a requirement to subsidise some of the age bill) etc.

Clearly there are still some significant issues to address which is why I suspect Trevor Birch has been brought in, hopefully he can see there is some real potential in this squad and will be able to find a way of supporting Potter as well as ensuring we get the best possible price for those assets we decide to move on. After what’s taking place over the last few years, I hope the club can consolidate and start to move forward.


If they can shift out the remaining high earners there should be extra scope for Potter to spend. If they can't, there won't.

Let's hope Birch is a better negotiator than Huwbert. It's probably not hard to manage that.

Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.

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Accounts 17-18 on 23:36 - Apr 27 with 2500 viewsjasper_T

The fact that the owners were willing to spend £7m before failing to get fees for certain players last summer suggests there is/was some light at the end of the tunnel, as they'd have had the financial picture shown in these accounts at that time. They called it a multi-year plan for a return to the PL, not a one year gamble (Huw was the only one to claim an immediate return was aimed for iirc) so hopefully that's still the idea.

Sky commentators today said Norwich had to raise £30m the summer they sold Madison or they'd have gone bust. Don't think we're quite that badly off. Selling DJ should see some spending money come in, not just pay the day to day bills. Provided something can be done about the loan players who will return.
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Accounts 17-18 on 00:03 - Apr 28 with 2474 viewsChief

Accounts 17-18 on 22:23 - Apr 27 by Dr_Winston

If they can shift out the remaining high earners there should be extra scope for Potter to spend. If they can't, there won't.

Let's hope Birch is a better negotiator than Huwbert. It's probably not hard to manage that.


Your first paragraph... Wasn't that the mantra during the last transfer window... And the one before that

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Accounts 17-18 on 00:06 - Apr 28 with 2466 viewsDr_Winston

Accounts 17-18 on 00:03 - Apr 28 by Chief

Your first paragraph... Wasn't that the mantra during the last transfer window... And the one before that


So you'd rather spend money the club hasn't got?

Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.

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Accounts 17-18 on 00:09 - Apr 28 with 2460 viewsChief

Cash flow....unachievimg commercial opportunities...

Sounds familiar

What exactly are the yanks needed for? What's the point in them?

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Accounts 17-18 on 00:16 - Apr 28 with 2447 viewsDr_Winston

Accounts 17-18 on 00:09 - Apr 28 by Chief

Cash flow....unachievimg commercial opportunities...

Sounds familiar

What exactly are the yanks needed for? What's the point in them?


Commercially we seem to be doing better than we were when F*ckwit Dineen held the reins during a better period for the club. Otherwise there is no need for the Americans. There never was past the point of enriching the previous shareholders.

None of which is particularly relevant. The club is in the situation it's in and the only sensible actions are being taken.

Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.

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Accounts 17-18 on 00:21 - Apr 28 with 2437 viewsChief

Accounts 17-18 on 00:06 - Apr 28 by Dr_Winston

So you'd rather spend money the club hasn't got?


But I thought we were owned by people who possess the resources to make us competitive?

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Accounts 17-18 on 00:24 - Apr 28 with 2432 viewsChief

Accounts 17-18 on 00:16 - Apr 28 by Dr_Winston

Commercially we seem to be doing better than we were when F*ckwit Dineen held the reins during a better period for the club. Otherwise there is no need for the Americans. There never was past the point of enriching the previous shareholders.

None of which is particularly relevant. The club is in the situation it's in and the only sensible actions are being taken.


Well the rumours point to the fact that are we aren't doing any better than under 'fuxkwit' Dineen?

Didn't he have to step in at one point and get some (shitty) sponsorship deal over the line that the yanks failed to?

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Accounts 17-18 on 00:27 - Apr 28 with 2426 viewsjasper_T

Accounts 17-18 on 00:21 - Apr 28 by Chief

But I thought we were owned by people who possess the resources to make us competitive?


70% of our owners do, judging by what's being spent at DC United.

We were competitive this season.
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Accounts 17-18 on 00:35 - Apr 28 with 2416 viewsChief

Accounts 17-18 on 00:27 - Apr 28 by jasper_T

70% of our owners do, judging by what's being spent at DC United.

We were competitive this season.


Ah right OK

So if we'd been relegated the league 1 this season example, and then next we finished 10th ish

By your logic, we could look back at their 'we've got the resources to compete' and said well we've been competitive

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Accounts 17-18 on 00:40 - Apr 28 with 2411 viewsDr_Winston

Accounts 17-18 on 00:24 - Apr 28 by Chief

Well the rumours point to the fact that are we aren't doing any better than under 'fuxkwit' Dineen?

Didn't he have to step in at one point and get some (shitty) sponsorship deal over the line that the yanks failed to?


"Rumours"

Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back.

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